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Q1:
What is corrosive ammunition, and what should I know and do about it?
      What makes corrosive ammo? - Is mine corrosive? -  How do I clean my rifle after using corrosive ammo?  - How quickly can the rust cause a problem?

Q2:

What is the best way to remove cosmoline?

Q3:

What kind of finish is on my stock?
      The finish on my stock is flaky... How do I fix that?

Q4:

How do I load my Mosin-Nagant with a stripper clip, [charger]?

Q5:

My Bolt sticks after I fire a round, and I can hardly get the bolt open. What is this?


Q6:
Where is the safety on my Mosin Nagant & how does it work?

Q7:
How do I tell where my rifle was made?
     Arsenals / manufacturer that made Mosins

Q8:
What does the "r" stand for in 7.62x65r?
What does the "r" stand for after the date on the top of the barrel shank?

Q9:
What does counter bored mean?

Q10:
What measurements are the markings on the sights? (yards, meters, etc)

Q11:
What is force matching?

Q12:
Which way does my sling go on?

Q13:
How do you pronounce "Mosin Nagant"?

Q14:
How do I tell if my Mosin is an ex-sniper?

Q15:
What is a "M44 Stock" on a M38 rifle? or What is the difference between a M44 Stock and a M38 Stock?

Q16:
What is the definition of Curios or Relics
(C&R) firearms and what is an antique firearm?

Q17:
What is a "bound book"?

Q18:
How do you disassemble the bolt on a Mosin Nagant rifle, and reassemble it?


Do you have more questions? Please send them to webmaster@russian-mosin-nagant.com and maybe we can use them or,
post them to the
Forums




Q1      What is corrosive ammunition, and what should I know and do about it?
               What makes corrosive ammo?
                    Is my ammo corrosive?
                    How do I clean my rifle after using corrosive ammo?
                   
How quickly can the rust (corrosion) cause a problem?


What makes corrosive ammo?
Corrosive ammunition has primers that leave a potassium chloride (a type of salt) residue in the rifle after the cartridge is fired. The salt attracts water and the water causes the metal to rust.

Is my ammo corrosive?
Most foreign military 7.62x54R surplus ammunition is “corrosive”.  Always assume military surplus 7.62x54R ammunition is corrosive or risk a rusted and pitted barrel. Some is not corrosive and you should always ask.

Most "modern" ammo is not corrosive. Look for the "words "boxer primer" and chances are very good it is not corrosive.

How do I clean my rifle after using corrosive ammo?
The salt can be cleaned out of the bore by running water soaked patches straight through the bore. Do not pull the patches back – let them fall off when    through the bore.
Some shooters like to use an ammonia based cleaner (which is mostly water). Others like to pour boiling hot water through the bore. If you use strong chemicals or hot water you should consider removing the barrel from the stock. It is possible to ruin a stock this way.

Next run a couple of dry patches through the bore and clean the bore with a regular bore cleaning solvent such as Hoppe’s No. 9. This will remove the other types of residue from the bore.

Clean the other metal surfaces such as on the bolt, extended bayonet, etc. using first water or a water based cleaner as above, and then regular solvent.

Finish with a light coating of oil on all surfaces.

Always run a dry patch or two through the bore before shooting the rife.

How quickly can the rust (corrosion) cause a problem?
In a humid climate rust can start to form in an unclean bore in as little as 15 minutes.  Active rust in a bore can be cleaned with a good bore brush and some solvent after some boiling water has been run through it to remove any salts that might be causing the rust in the first place.  Once the bore is clear of the rust itself you will be left with the pits the rust caused in the metal, this is metal the rust ate, and what causes a bore to look dark after it has been cleaned of normal fouling.  The pits can effect accuracy negatively, but not always if they are very small, and well away from the muzzle, but they will not cause any unsafe operating conditions so long as they have not massively eroded one or more areas to the point the barrel is thinned (deep pitting). If your rifle has the common sort of pitting often found in military surplus rifles that shot nothing but corrosive ammo for all of their service lives.  Scrub it, use JB bore paste, and fire it, this will also loosen stubborn deposits in the lands of the bore after the bulk has been scrubbed away.

If you live a good distance from the range, and can't clean the rifle within a hour after shooting, spray some Windex down the bore after you are done shooting, Then a dry patch, then a patch with a good gun oil. This will hold you off for a few hours till you get home and do the full cleaning. Just remember, these are ex military rifles.  When  they were in service, they saw many hours after firing that they were not cleaned because of the circumstances. We don't have those same circumstances today and should clean them as soon as possible.

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Q2
     
What is the best way to remove cosmoline?


What is the best way to remove cosmoline?
There are two proven ways to remove cosmoline from your stock.

The "best way" is to thoroughly wrap your stock in newspaper (removed from the rifle) and place it in a large/sturdy black plastic garbage bag. Seal it up well and place it on the dash of your vehicle on a warm sunny day. Leave it there for at least two hours or more. This will "bake" the stock & heat up the cosmoline causing it to melt out of the wood & into the newspaper. Simply remove the stock & wipe it down. If necessary, repeat the procedure.

Less recommended way (safety and care is very important and never it unattended).
Make & place a tinfoil tray in the bottom rack of the oven & turn the oven on low (No more than 150 degrees). Put the stock in for about 20 minutes. Once it is warmed up, carefully remove it & wipe it down. Repeat the process until the results are satisfactory.

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Q3
     
What kind of finish is on my stock?
              The finish on my stock is flaky... How do I fix that?

What kind of finish is on my stock?
That is a tough question because just about every kind of finish know to man (during and before WWII) was used on the Mosin. But if it is a Russian refurbish rifle (which is what most are that are sold in the large chain stores today), then it is more than likely shellac. In most cases it was tinted red by the arsenals and slopped on sometime pretty thick. The prep work before hand may not have been the best either. If it was put on over cosmoline (or some oil) and not cleaned well, it will flake off in patches (sometimes).

The finish on my stock is flaky... How do I fix that?
It's easy, we are a preservation forum and don't advocate altering the rifle. There is one thing that is "except able by many" that you can do.  Shellac can be "melted"  with alcohol. So using a cotton swab (Q-Tip) and some alcohol you can soften the surrounding shellac and move the mixture into the small area where it has flaked off. This works well for small areas and not so well for larger area.

But the best thing to do (and is what we do) is, enjoy the rifle as it is! Those bumps and bruises and flaky shellac is all part of the rifle's history and character. Altering it will drop the value of a rifle, and all Mosins are collectible (don't let anyone tell you differently). The fact that right now they are inexpensive to buy does not make them a good rifle to destroy. I and many others can tell you about the days k98k Mausers were sold as "junk" rifles because they were made in the millions. You could buy one for under $50. Many matching Mausers got cut up into sportsters back then. I'll bet those owners wish they had those all matching Mausers back now...they sell for over $1200 now. LOL


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Q4      How do I load my Mosin-Nagant with a stripper clip, [charger]?

Place the 5 round charger clip over the mag well with your thumb over the rim of the cartridge pushing down & your index finger under the bullet tip slightly lifting up & guiding down as well.

While loading, keep in mind to place the rim of the top round in front of the rim of the round beneath it (see photo below)



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Q5      My Bolt sticks after I fire a round, and I can hardly get the bolt open. What is this?

My Bolt sticks after I fire a round, and I can hardly get the bolt open. What is this?
This is know as "Sticky Bolt Syndrome" and is common in Mosin Nagants. There are a couple of things that can cause this.

Failure to clean the old cosmoline completely out of the chamber. All it takes is one small hard to see piece of dried cosmoline on the chamber wall and it will "glue" the last round fired in place. The heat will soften the cosmoline just enough and when the brass case expands in the chamber it will glue that round right in. Opening the bolt and tapping the bolt handle backwards with a rubber mallet till it releases is the best way to open..  If that fails, you can get a wooden dowel small enough to fit inside the opening of an empty brass case. stick it down the barrel  (muzzle  end)  and tap the case out with a small hammer. a good solid ramrod works or even the ramrod that comes on it, but be careful not to mess up the crown (muzzle end).

The second thing that can cause this (but much less likely) is steel cased ammo with lacquer on them. Some of the older ammo that is steel cased have this problem, but for the most part the new steel is OK. Some old brass rounds are coated also. This lacquer (or clear coating) has the same effect as the cosmoline above. So clearing it is the same.

When you get those new Mosin Nagant rifles, take a 24 ga shotgun brass brush to the chamber and clean it really good before taking it to the range and you will not have the problems....usually! LOL



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Q6     Where is the safety on my Mosin Nagant & how does it work?

Where is the safety on my Mosin Nagant & how does it work?
Yes; with the bolt closed, pull back on the bolt and rotate counter-clockwise and release.  Your rifle is now "safe".
First place the butt plate of the rifle in the crook of the elbow, then pull back on the cocking piece and rotate it counter-clockwise about 45 degrees.

Removal of the safety
Special care should be taken when taking it off safe, as it is possible to have an Accidental Discharge. Have the butt plate in the crook of the elbow again, and be sure to have the muzzle pointed in a safe direction. It's best to practice with a firearm you personally have assured is UNLOADED.

While using the safety, ALWAYS treat your firearm as though it does not have a safety and is loaded.


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Q7      How do I tell where my rifle was made?
              Arsenals / manufacturer that made Mosins

You can "start" to find out where your rifle was made (if it is a Russian made rifle) buy starting here
../new_owner_ID/index.html

More advanced study is needed on "un-common" rifles

Arsenals / manufacturer that made Mosins (
WWII and earlier  makers)
Russian Arsenals:
Izhevsk (City and commonly used) Izmash(Factory, less commonly used)......pronounced "ee-ZHYEVSK",  the“zh” sounds like “s”
http://www.merriam-webster.com/cgi-bin/audio.pl?ggizhe01.wav=Izhevsk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KL7nCF_h7XA

Tula:
Sestroryetsk  ......pronounced "syiss-trah-RYEHTSK"
First few seconds of the video http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3900411367538735432&ei=MJqESbD5J4SQqAKvwNjrCg&q=sestroretsk&hl=en#

US Manufacturers:
Remington
New England Westinghouse

French Arsenal:
Chatellerault
http://www.forvo.com/word/ch%C3%A2tellerault/  

Finnish Makers:
Tikkakoski  (Tikka)
VKT ( Valtion Kivääritehdas  or Valmet)
Sako

Arsenals / manufacturer that made Mosins (Post WWII)

Hungry
"
02" stamped on most parts

Poland
"
circle 11" on the barrel shank and on many places on the rifle;

China
Chinese writing on the barrel shank

Czechoslovakia
Made M91/38's from m91's. Looked like a M91/59 or M38. Easy to spot as they have the old arsenal markings on the barrel shank, but look like the newer carbines.

Romania
"Three "R"'s surrounded by crossed stalks with leaves pointing outwards are on the top of the breech."

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Q8      What does the "r" stand for in 7.62x65r?
               What does the "r" stand for after the date on the top of the barrel shank?

What does the "r" stand for in 7.62x65r?
It stands for "Rimmed". The ammunition has a rim at the base and sticks out just a little from the case.

What does the "r" stand for after the date on the top of the barrel shank?
It is the Russian marking indicating "year"

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Q9      What does counter bored mean?

Typically when troops cleaned their rifles in the field using the cleaning rod that came with it, they did a lot of damage to the crown (the end of the barrel called the muzzle). Also when the crown was "shot out" from many rounds going through the barrel, the crown suffered also. When the crown is damaged the accuracy will be lowered dramatically. To correct this damage you have to either cut off the barrel and re-crown it, or replace the barrel. Another more cost effective way is to counter boar the end of the barrel. In effect putting a new crown on it deeper in the barrel where it is actually now protected. The Russians and Finns did this to save money and to "fix the problems".

Looking at the photo below. Look down the barrel and you will see how the bore has been machined open creating a new crown deeper in. This is not a negative if you like to shoot. In fact it may shoot better after doing so. It may be a bit of a minus for a collectible, but not that bad.

The saying is, "it's better to have a counter boared rifle, then one that is not counter boared and the crown is bad."

Counter boared Mosin Nagant
                                rifle


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Q10     What measurements are the markings on the sights? (yards, meters, etc)

What measurements are the markings on the sights? (yards, meters, etc)
Short answer is as follows:


(photos below)
4, 6, 8, 10, and 12 representing hundreds of arshini (a early Russian measurement) Typical on M91 type Mosins
  




(photo below)
On M91/30 the graduations are on top of the leaf. 1 to 20 representing hundreds of meters. Russians converted over to metric.
No Photo Yet!





(photo below
Finn remarked their sights in meters. Typically they will have the original Russian marks (arshini) on the opposite side (on some rifles)




Later marked Finn sights in meters (M28/30 and M39)
   





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Q11     What is force matching?

When a rifle was originally built in Russia, all the serial #'s matched. Barrel shank, bolt, bottom of magazine (door), and butt plate. Later after the rifle was refurbished or parts replaced they "force marked" the replaced or mis matched parts. Sometime they did this with stamps (sometimes the fonts don't match) and sometimes they did it with an electric pencil. Most Finnish rifles are force marked because they are a conglomeration of used parts, reassembled into a working rifle. They wasted very little. Some rifles are expected to be force matched, but the less it is done, the more collectible it is.

Most refurbished Russian Mosin Nagants are force matched on the bolt a the very least. Originally the letter prefix came on the bolt as well as all the parts, but most refurbished rifles don't have the letter prefix and only carry the numbers. The one's that do have the prefix usually always have a miss matched font on the letters indicating the bolt was changed at a latter date. It is expected and excepted on the refurbished Mosin Nagants.

A rifle with all matching and original marks is harder to find and raises the collectors value.


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Q12     Which way does my sling go on?


Russian Rifles with "Dog Collars"


Finnish Rifles with "hangers"




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Q13     How do you pronounce "Mosin Nagant"?


How do you pronounce "Mosin Nagant"?
Place the emphasis on bold syllables:
moye seen  nah gon


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Q14     How do I tell if my Mosin is an ex-sniper?

How do I tell if my Mosin is an ex-sniper?

If you think you may have a M91/30  ex PU sniper it is very easy to tell.  Open the bolt and look in the inside of the receiver  (see photo below)
When these  were taken  out of service (for what ever reason) they were returned to duty as standard M91/30's and they did this by  inserting  screws into the mount holes and  welding them up on the outside and grinding them off.. So from the outside the rifle looks normal, but from inside of the receiver you can see the screws. (see below).



On a Izhevsk rifle they didn't always remove the scope numbers from the left side of the barrel shank, they just "lined them out". (see below)



On a Tula exsniper, on the top of the barrel shank is the large star indicating manufacture in the Tula plant. Above that star are the letters CN or CH, and that either indicates that at one time it was a sniper or met sniper standards.

Sorry, not photo yet.



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Q15     What is a "M44 Stock" on a M38 rifle? or What is the difference between a M44 Stock and a M38 Stock?







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Q16     What is the definition of Curios or Relics (C&R) firearms and what is an antique firearm?


What is a Curio or Relics (C&R) firearm
Quote from: ATF:
Firearms which are of special interest to collectors by reason of some quality other than is associated with firearms intended for sporting use or as offensive or defensive weapons. To be recognized as curios or relics, firearms must fall within one of the following categories:

(a) Firearms which were manufactured at least 50 years prior to the current date, but not including replicas thereof;

(b) Firearms which are certified by the curator of a municipal, State, or Federal museum which exhibits firearms to be curios or relics of museum interest; and

(c) Any other firearms which derive a substantial part of their monetary value from the fact that they are novel, rare, bizarre, or because of their association with some historical figure, period, or event. Proof of qualification of a particular firearm under this category may be established by evidence of present value and evidence that like firearms are not available except as collector's items, or that the value of like firearms available in ordinary commercial channels is substantially less.

**********************************************************************
Note that if a particular firearm was made 50 or more years ago, it qualifies as a Relic per subparagraph (a) but that does not mean that all firearms of a model year qualify.

For example, not all Model 1894 Winchesters would qualify as a relic. Only those actually made 50 or more years longer ago would be relics.

You would have to see if a later made Model 1894 qualifies as a Curio by checking the ATF Curios or Relics List.


This is the definition of an Antique Firearm:
Quote from: ATF
 
(a) Any firearm (including any firearm with a matchlock, flintlock, percussion cap, or similar type of ignition system) manufactured in or before 1898; and

(b) any replica of any firearm described in paragraph (a) of this definition if such replica
(1) is not designed or redesigned for using rim fire or conventional center fire fixed ammunition, or
(2) uses rim fire or conventional center fire fixed ammunition which is no longer manufactured in the United States and which is not readily available in the ordinary channels of commercial trade.

As mentioned above, the date the particular rifle was made is what matters, not the model year. Thus a Mauser Model 98 made in 1898 would be an antique; one made during WWI or WWII would not be an Antique but would qualify as a Relic.
 


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Q17     What is a "bound book"?


What is a "bound book"?
http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/faq2.htm#e1
A "bound book" is a permanently bound book or an orderly arrangement of loose-leaf pages which must be maintained on the business premises. The format must follow that prescribed in the regulations, and the pages must be numbered consecutively. [27 CFR 478.121 and 478.125]
*****************************************************
This is a book that is kept by other FFL holders, but in our situation when we are talking about a 03FFL license, it is a requirement to log in and out all rifles purchased or sold into the book while you are a holder of that license. It doesn't matter if you used your license to purchase the rifle or not, it must be logged into or out of the book if you are holding a 003FFL license at the time.



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Q18     How do you disassemble the bolt on a Mosin Nagant rifle, and reassemble it?

How do you disassemble the bolt (and put it back together)?
Please see the "Disassembly and Cleaning article" on the main page

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